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Saying it's all effortlessly happening, everything is preordained, there are no doers, there are no choices, you are not the author of anything you think or do, etc; are exactly the same pointer, but the pointer itself is beyond the reality of what it points to and therefore the point of the pointer is not to determine if the pointer is pointing to reality as it actually is.

Reality is idealess and if the pointers are taken to be reality then it will be conceptualized into an idea about what reality is, instead of being the reality you are which is non-conceptual.

As a result, the point of any pointer is to arrive at the feeling-sense of where the pointer is pointing, undisturbed peace, then the method of the pointer has done its job and can be thrown out.

In other words, all pointers are designed to reveal an idealess undisturbed peace then there is no you knowing any ideas about reality; there is only idealess peace which is uncaused and undisturbed.

Very few know reality as nothing but undisturbed peace, yet many do imagine that they know a lot about reality; worldly ideas and spiritual ideas alike. This never had anything to do with gaining knowledge about what reality is. It was always the end of concepts, a destruction of all ideas, which reveals an undisturbed peace as what you are.

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